I dunno really, the arguments against naming scammers are pretty convincing. If it will be allowed sooner or later it will become a mudslinging contest.
As I see it there is alot of room to eploit this .I see a need for it,but still ..a pic does not always show all sides.
I hope so.. My old soc had a scammer thread and it was quite helpful for everyone there, especially the newer folks.
As long as naming scammers is done using sufficient evidence, we have no issue with this. We feel it is important to warn newcomers and veterans alike against the less morally inclined subjects of our virtual society. We fully intend for this forum also to be meant as a public way for an alledged scammer to clear his or her name. If this has to be done in the universe, or someone's name is being spread in the universe as a suspected scammer, an innocent person could get his reputation destroyed that way. This place will give him a chance to share the other side of the story. Naturally, if not enough proof is provided, or false claims were made, we will ensure a ratification will follow. So, naming scammers is fine, as long as you do not shoot [STRIKE]at the knee[/STRIKE] from the hip.
Sollution: This was my idea years ago, and MA Support knows it too. ND was the person I went to first to cover myself with an alabi. A official virtual Police Service. With academy and peops can join to earn peds after completion of training. Own pilots, uniforms, weaponry, armor with Police Logos, Invizibility chips, special scanners mark 10 that can catch and suspend avas for arrests, etc. etc. etc. I have a full vision. Even Police terminals all over for crime reports, logging into work recieving patrol orders, etc. Mindark, did not show intrest. But an Idea has started brewing in me LOL, Jon always said I am a person just full of ideas and stuff, thats what he like bout Shin:) What If I focus my Forum purelly on Virtual Police matters? Say call it....Mmmmmm....Entropia Police Services Forum? EPS for short? What does the community think about this? I can go ahead and start work on my simplistic existing forum. My idea is to update it to V-Bullitin A.S.A.P. Got the server via Parre , so thats all kewl:) When done and launched officially, with a link from here to there for Virtual Crime reports. Mindark can bennifit from this exponetially, due to catagorically making their job and work load easier. Mabe, through this endeavour, I can make right with MA, far better than words alone.
Well personally I prefer that "Scamming Methods are Exposed" instead of a "name & shame thread" or "scammers list" or whatever...ppl that scam can always return with a new avatar etc... ...as I understand it, in the past, a "name & shame" section on Entropia Forum existed, and caused many problems in the community including: intentionally false accusations unsubstantiated accusations misunderstandings discord among members and societies overwhelming workload for forum moderators ...but its your forum, your playground...Im just giving you guys a heads-up! ;) Regards! //jim_T
Jim youve just listed my reasons exactly to the T, for why I came up with my Virtual Police Services Idea in the first place. Not to mention two succesfull yet somewhat different scams in-game, of which I was a victim long ago. Many gamers supported me and most called it a brilliant sollution. Only Mindark rejected the idea outright. I am still waiting on any reactions, regarding my previous reply with the idea to dedicate my forum purelly to police matters and Call it E.P.S. Entropia Police Services.
Libel still applies online and probably extends to virtual worlds. pretty sure there have been cases from Second Life and definatly have been on forums and what are the differences? put simply, if you name and shame (which i believe should be supported) it should be done so in the knowledge that if you claim is false or challenged as such, your details will be forwarded to enable libel case to be pursued. you cannot legally hide behind the "anonymity" of a internet avatar and neither should a forum support you doing so.
Of course not. The section is meant to offer some form of help to players, and not as a personal battleground. And naturally, real life laws still apply. Should there ever be a case where someone is proven to have been falsely accused, like stated, we will insist that ractifications are made. I do like the idea of also creating a thread outlining potential scamming mechanisms that we can point new users to.
We used to have a scammer section on Euforces in the past. But we decided to skip it when we moved to our new forum. The reason for that was that is so easy to come up with false accusations. And it took much effort for the admins to monitor what was right or wrong to stay at the forum posts. But it serves a good purpose to expose the scamming methods from real cases.
Have to agree with Jim T here The monitoring of a "name and shame forum" will be extremely difficult and I think you will find more false accusations than valid ones And forcing a false accusation to be rectified may not be enough to restore the falsely accused ava's rep
Some good points here, and we will take them into consideration, for sure. We can always try and see how things develop, and keep a good eye open for anyhting posted here. Should it turn out to end up in constructive debate, and some new people not being scammed due to a warning, it would be great. Should things get ugly, we can always change the policy.
Dont like my idea Peter? Less work for you and MA. In fact Forum Entropia Police Services could be used for crime reports. Witness testomonies. The community is in fact the jury. Forum admin close cases with votes regarding the otcome and suitable actions to be taken, etc. etc. Nothing wrong in experimenting and putting the idea to a test But still, I would rather want to see a official MA virtual Police Service, patroling, assisting and investigating in-game. Full academy for training, etc. Police Terminals for Police use only. Specialized Police equipment, like invisibility chips, weaponry and also a special Police scanner, that can scan more than skills allone and with some special features. The police force must also be Interplanetary with HQs on each planet, space station, etc. Unique police clothing line, including special Police armor sets with Police Logos and in Blue. Mabe realize the usage of those hover-platforms , always parked at PA, dunno if they are still there LOL. Exelent for patroling via the air, great freedom and only useable for Police officers. Immagine the Movie shots and angles taken from the air and/or following a hunting party, just for great vid shots LOL. Citizens could also report crimes and scams via the Police terminals, then handled by Police after that. Constant Police presence at places Like PA, keeping the peace, observing the trades and chatspams etc. You get the idea
I must admit, Shinobi, I do not fancy any idea of an in game EU police. Dunno, but I do not believe the game is ready for it and you can't really be sure that the people you choose as 'the police' is not personally affected in some cases, either. I would rather see MA doing something about the cases they get themselves now - and from their department - than I would like to see some people from the community going around playing police. Letting the community decide the outfall is also way too democratic for me - in case a person is not that well liked for other reasons, you don't belive that could effect peoples choise of 'justice'? Just my two pecs
ye but thats why an academy for a period of specialized basic training and a secondary phase of training. Not easy to get in, u know. And the screening is very tight too. When training is complete, its a virtual job, civil service. Logging in at term for duty, and actually earning peds per hour, untill job is done then logg off at term. Strict rules of conduct and all that. Even a Group of IA officers, internal affairs. The whole shebang girl:) And obviously this is no small thing and for implimentation, full power and assistance from MA. This will bridge the gap between MA and client, when selected collonists who also want to be part of it, finiish their training as first E.P.S. RL Police are big on evidence right? So too virtual police;) Innocent untill proven guilty. Courtroom on forum. Evidence locker. Representation. And very fairly. evidence could be chat-logg recordings. Fraps-shots, witness testimonies. As with RL Cops, EPS shall be trained to take witnesss statements, record chats, seperatelly, when multiple witneses are involved. Not to mention, Police patroling act as a deterent in itself. Police corruption shall not be tollerated and a immediate perm-bann results with following investigation bridging both VR and RL. Trust me, you do NOT want a perm ban from MA, that alone is an unpleasant ordeal, I should know. There is no righteous and FAIR Justice in EU, this i know also, and this idea, implimented, will realize exactly that for the bennifit for all and a Golden future in the comming age.
Trouble is that unlike real-world police, the investigation that can be conducted by participants or forum members will be forced to focus only on presented details, rather than all evidence available, as nobody other than MindArk has access to their logfiles. And MindArk themselves seem to not want to get involved unless contacted by actual authorities, or when it's MindArk themselves who are at some form of risk. Lastly, the idea of an ingame policeforce makes me think too much of government. Other than that, most "crimes" are not committed or recordable in public chat, which kind of rules out the ability to achieve anything.
Exactlly! This is why I Immediatelly approached MA with the idea, after consulting JJ first OFC, and sent the detailed idea directly to support in full written form. That was long ago. Dont think it went any further than support dept. alone. Nevertheless, for the vision to work, full cooperation and involvement of Mindark in such an endeavour is therefore crucial to make it succesfull. And it is a brilliant idea purelly catered around the EU platform. No one can use it exept MA. Isnt Mindark functioning as a government for years? Absolute power corupts absolutelly right? Youve been around long enought to know virtual history and rants. The verse is expanding. Do you as a virtual citizen want to remain under a draconian dictatorship? Shouldnt it be held accounteable to the people? You cant have a full expanding virtuality with the realism, and without the full infra. A Police Services would bennifit both the peops and economy. The idea works in conjunction with a forum. not nececarilly this one. Also bennifits MA regarding support scam cases and it is properly , proffesionally handled by qalified skilled peops. In-game police conduct shall also be impecable and proffesional respectfully so. They will mostlly stay in the social background and Never harrass collonists. Always approacheable for collonists and assistance. Always ready to help and answer Questions. Friendly with humor and character. Peops must feel safe with an EPS. They will be representing the "company" ofc, therefore strict conduct rules. Suppose when implemented, EULA, should also be added on to, LOL Tweaked is more like it. I want both Emma and Simon to go through the training. They keep their Jobs and everything, just ready for "call - up" duty when big shit hits the fan. Plain clothed cops, the both of them.
