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Entropia News: Yog Pet Buff Issue

Discussion in 'Entropia News' started by EP-Newsbot, Jun 17, 2020.

  1. Yog Pet Buff Issue

    In this announcement we’d like to provide a further update on the pet buff issue that was addressed last week.

    Understandably, there has been intense community interest in this issue since the bug was corrected last week, in the form of forum discussions and support cases. We have had time to dig deeper into how the buff issue happened, why it was not caught by our normal testing procedures, and how it was able to persist for so long without being corrected.

    The initial bug that allowed all tools and weapons to benefit from the reduced delay buff (rather than just excavators, as intended) arose in September 2018, approximately 6 months after the Yog pet was introduced. Subsequently over the next few months, several support cases were submitted describing the issue with varying degrees of detail.

    Unfortunately, these support cases were not escalated to the testing and development teams and/or flagged with a sufficient level of urgency that reflected the seriousness of the issue. We will be taking steps to improve our internal processes to prevent such situations in the future.

    As soon as the issue became more widely known late last week, we moved very quickly to correct the issue via a server hotfix. Note that for approximately 30 hours after the server hotfix, the Entropia Universe client still showed that the buff was affecting tools other than excavators, even though the server was not actually providing any buff for those items. This has led to some participants reporting that the issue has not been resolved, despite it having been resolved.

    Along with the server hotfix which corrected the pet buff issue, Summer Mayhem scores for 12 participants were removed, due to the possibility that the incorrect pet buff may have been active during those sessions. Please note that those removed scores do not necessarily constitute clear evidence of cheating or abuse on the part of the affected participants. For that reason, those participants were not disqualified from the event, as some participants have called for. However, out of an abundance of caution to ensure the integrity of the Summer Mayhem event, it was decided to remove those scores, even if it was not absolutely certain that there was an intention to gain an unfair advantage in the event.

    Additionally, some participants have demanded a review of the results from previous Mayhem events where the unintended Yog pet buff may have provided an advantage, inadvertently or intentionally. We will be conducting this investigation over the next few weeks, with the intention of increasing the prize rewards for any participants who were pushed down in the final standings due to another higher-placing participant benefitting from the unintended pet buff.

    Due to the unintended Yog pet buff being available for such an extended period of time, despite support cases that should have resulted in the issue being addressed, and considering that it is not possible to definitively conclude that use of the pet was in every case intended to exploit the buff to gain an advantage, MindArk has decided it would be unfair and impractical to punish participants who directly or indirectly benefited from the unintended buff, for example stripping prizes awarded in previous Mayhem events.

    Once again, we want to extend our apologies for the confusion and inconvenience this issue has caused. We are continually improving our processes to hopefully prevent and minimize such incidents in the future.

    • Funny Funny x 3
  2. Fan_boy99

    Fan_boy99 Ignore Spawn and San they are Sheeples

    Same thing. Another year. Big outcry. Fan boys/girls saying thanks for the communication …….. Ah well until Xmas then starts alllll over again.

    A Thesis in Phycology of addicted gamblers could genuinely be written about this &%$.

    Ah. There are some who ''put their kids through College and withdraw 1000s Euros per month'' though...…..^^^. For sure we need some more about Mr College on the big picture :)….


    The initial bug that allowed all tools and weapons to benefit from the reduced delay buff (rather than just excavators, as intended) arose in September 2018

    The ONLY reason these exploits get noticed is that some users get boastful. Like the Entropia Raider. Mashermesh brought that 1 up again when is actively many many users (not saying it is a BAD thing that mastermesh brought it up) but Simmonds and Jan don't give a fu*k and the exploits would have continued if the exploiters kept their big mouths shut. Anyway it is the same every-single-year.

    Look at the Big Picture :)

    Edited - really looking forward to Marks comment on THIS 1 ahhaha
  3. Fan_boy99

    Fan_boy99 Ignore Spawn and San they are Sheeples

    I had to say this because I know Mark will later.

    Usual fanboys=

    ''Well thank you very much for this exhaustive information. It was really needed.''

    ''Thank you.''

    ''Fair enough for me. ''

    ''MindArk, thank you for the update''

    I only read the first 3 pages because i cant stop laughing. The Shop and LA owners fanboy-ism is beyond real lol.

    This 1 definitely has to be added to the big picture! :)
    • Funny Funny x 1
  4. Mindark used all of the various assumptions made by the community in 1 announcement.
    Community and Mindark working very well together. x'D

    This is so full of bullshit... :)

    And no, its not the fault of the (real) community.

    By now it is really the fault of the steady big depositors and the disturbed gamblers.
    (That are also the biggest cry babies)
    They will never learn and keep this always sinking ship moving towards the giant waterfall...slow, but sure.

    It is already inside the download version of the big picture.
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2020
  5. NotAdmin

    NotAdmin Administrator

    To me the thread on PCF reads different than usual. A lot of angry and disappointed people who suddenly realized what most people here have known all along; The MA "Support" team doesn't do its' job. The MA QA team is either non-existent, or incompetent. Whatever logs MA has, they are only referenced whenever something is pointed out to MA, rather than them implementing a pro-active system that flags suspicious behaviour.

    And management is utterly incompetent, as this shit has been going on for as long as MA has been around, and nothing has been done. Whether that's due to the cheaters and botters helping MAs bottom line or not I'll leave in the middle, but I'm happy as hell that I've committed my withdrawal prior to this.
  6. I was surprised they said anything at all..tbh. I thought a huge middle finger up at everyone was coming. I just want to know who the 12 are, I'm sure many societies would like to know if any of their members were involved other than Payne Inc. Or maybe I'm just very nosey and there it is. :thumbup:
  7. Wistrel

    Wistrel Kick Ass Elf

    Presumably this is referring to their tried and tested, "throw it out there and hope for the best" procedure (because players make the best free testing labour there is)

    Soooo.... I'm guessing that means they'll instruct support to stop copy pasting "go away" replies and filing everything into that place that no one in MA ever looks.... because... well you know... jumping on the cryptocurrency or mobile app "already sailed ships" is way more interesting than dealing with boooooooooring support cases that moan about insignificant little buff bugs that "probably aren't true anyhow".

    OK I'll be clear, while that may sound flippant I seriously suspect there may be a decent degree of truth to it. Anyone who's ever worked a support role will know that the majority of people who report problems don't really know what they are talking about. To be fair, this isn't a criticism. For example, if I was logging a ticket about a gas boiler, I'd literally be saying "er... well normally when I press the button it makes a clunky noise after a few seconds and then lights... but I hear nothing but a slight whirring" (guess who had to ring back the guy who did the gas safety check last week - knobber had bloody well left the darn thing switched off, seriously, who does that?) My point is that most people don't have an understanding of computer programming so they wouldn't be able to think helpfully about the nature of the problem or how to properly evidence it to support, or how to think about the potential knock on effects and severity of the issue.

    Lets be fair, a buff (and lets be even fairer, most buffs are so damn slight that they hardly warrant even existing - let alone any money) that is slightly overbuffing doesn't sound like cause for claxons on the surface and besides.... faster tool use means more decay for MA right?..... riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight???? ,-) So.... "we can fix that one... y'know... when we ah... 'get round to it' if you see what I'm saying?". Now, I mentioned that most users are not good at logging support tickets, but in such cases (and I warrant that there are exceptions - I'll come to those) this is where it is absolutely crucial to hire good support staff and not just "log and flog" script monkeys. You need people who are good communicators who are good at analysis and have the patience to guide the users through adequately describing the problem. Said support staff should then, using their hidden knowledge of the game, think about the possible extent of the problem and make judgement calls as to the severity. So while I wouldn't expect a user to think of the fact that a speed buff gives an unfair advantage in competitions, I would expect the support staff to.

    I mentioned though that some people ARE really good at describing problems though and even capable of thinking through the worst case implications of said problems and I can tell you for a fact those people get ignored along with everyone else. I know this because I count myself among those people and once upon a time reported, in explicit detail, having performed 3 documented tests, a repeatable method for taking out a whole area server. I can tell you that nothing happened with support until I eventually went and told an MA representative who was hanging around at PA. I shouldn't have had to have done that.

    Anyhow. Rant over, it is what it is. And I'm sad to see that nothing appears to have changed even after all these years. That said, I am encouraged to see such a frank explanation from the comms person. I don't think I've ever seen MA open up like that before or admit that there is a problem that needs to be addressed. So this is indeed a good thing. My only hope now is that the mess they've made themselves in having to pick through all that data to work out (even for events only) who was using the exploit and what impact it may have had on results will be a good lesson learned that if they let these bugs slide, it will only make things worse for them down the line.

    Fingers crossed anyhow but no breath held.

    PS if anyone is interested in the server crash bug, I wrote a fictionalised account of it in The Calypso Post, it was called "City Bomb: Entropia Terrorism" http://www.entropiaplanets.com/wiki/File:The_Calypso_Post_No5_June_2007.pdf

    • Like Like x 1
  8. Wistrel

    Wistrel Kick Ass Elf

    You know what, screw it, it was 14 years ago and this seems pretty darn relevant to the continued problem of MA not properly prioritising bugs. I can't remember exactly how long MA didn't respond to this one at the time. But I have a feeling it was at least 2 weeks before I told the MA rep at PA. 2 weeks to have something that, but a single glance at the title of, really should have set the alarm bells ringing. Yes yes I'm very aware this was 14 years ago, but clearly support issues still persist and really it isn't good enough.

    Hi there,
       I was just trying to colour something in game and discovered a bug that led to me resetting the server thats responsible for Nympth Town 3 times (about 19:30-20:00 GMT, 24th Jan 06). Sorry about that but I didn't realise the first time as I thought it was just cooincidence so wanted to be sure.
    There are a number of other things you can do with this bug that cause your own game to... well not exactly crash, but sorta lock you into what ever your doing (like inventory or storage) you can still do local chat etc and log out though. Another causes your screen view of the world to go grey and leaves you similarly "stuck".
    In case you know about this already, in short they are all to do with removing paint from the colourator before activating it.
    A) Here's how you crash the server:
    1. Activate colourator, put uncoloured item in and a paint can
    2. Drag paint can out of colourator and put it on the floor. This removes the paint can from the colourator and puts it on the floor but also puts it in your inventory...
    3. Press Apply in colourator (this doesn't colour the item because the colour is "sort of" on the floor)
    4. Access storage and drag the paint can from your inventory to a STACK of paint cans. This doesn't work but leaves the can in your inventory highlighted blue.
    5. Exit and re-enter storage and this crashes the server + disconnects you (obviously). When it comes back you can pick up the can as usual from where you left it
    Some other things related to the same bug:
    B) Turn view grey
    1. Do steps 1 and 2 from a)
    2. Have someone pick up the can from the floor
    reconnect rectifys the problem and the other avatar has the can
    C) Lock inventory
    1. Do steps 1, 2 and 3 from a)
    2. Try to drop the same can
    reconnect rectifys the problem can is now on floor only and can be picked up
    D) "Share" the can
    1. Do steps 1, 2 and 3 from a)
    2. Have someone pick up the can. Now you both have it. (You cannot trade the can to each other though, gives an internal server error problem)
    E) Other "locks"
    There were some other things you could do like, doing 1 and 2 from a) but putting the can in storage instead. This seems to lock things up but I can't remember exactly what the exact sequence of actions is. I'm sure you get the idea though.
    Right, again, apologies for crashing the server but I hope this information will help you fix the problem. No need for thanks, unless you really feel like dropping one of those (L) ukash guns my way... ,-)
    Good luck with the fix
    • Hussked Hussked x 2
    • Funny Funny x 1
  9. NotAdmin

    NotAdmin Administrator

    Here's some of the buying threads for Yogs on PCF I found with a quick search (Note: I'm not saying these are included in the 12. At least one guy also wanted an Extractor, so he might be a legit miner looking for a speed-boost. Should be easy to cross-check against Mayhem results, though):

    1: https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/showthread.php?313515-Yog-Horror
    2: https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/showthread.php?315592-Yog-Horror-Pet
    3: https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/...14701-Yog-Horror-and-Chikara-Refiner-Adjusted
    4: https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/showthread.php?313560-Yog-Horror
    • Winner Winner x 1
  10. NotAdmin

    NotAdmin Administrator

    Good points, Wis, but how would MA pay good support staff? There's several layers of management who are utterly useless *cough*Timkranss, Ssimmonds*cough*, but need to be paid far more than support staff. And you expect the support people to know the game? The developers barely know the game, judging by the amount of unit testing they do.
  11. Avatar "Toni Chiee Lahderinne" and Society "Payn-Inc." included.
    The society that reported the exploit 2 years ago and Mindark didnt care.

    Considering the yog went for 10k PED+ (lol)...Azzah and Chiee beeing professional miners...yah yah...

    Chiee lookin for one 3 days after Azzah.

    Still, Chiee probably only wanted to scam 2 people with the yog.

    1st the seller of the yog "plz sell cheap its only a mining buff"
    2nd the new owner (obvious exploiter) of the yog "me make you reload fast long time 1000$"

    1000 dollar yog meme.

    But who knows how much more dirt is attached to it.
    Hope to recieve more infos this weekend.

    yog buyers.
  12. Wistrel

    Wistrel Kick Ass Elf

    True. This is indeed the issue and not just at MA. In an ideally world somehow devs could do the support too as they could probably do it best in some ways. But in other ways they'd probably be bad. I could see a dev diving right into the problem and leaving a mile long queue of folks waiting to be served :D

    I wonder if there might be some sort of happy medium in a small company where dev's could handle support for something like 5% of their time. So 1 morning ever 2 weeks. It might even be a nice change for them and could help with their own normal work as they'd gain first hand understanding of the problems their mistakes cause. Of course... that would require a min of 20 devs to have just 1 person doing support 5 days a week. I'm fairly certain MA only have 1. That is, if the current level of output is to be used as any reasonable yardstick.
  13. people are bitching about yog as if it would be the end of the world, but it's no problem and fully OK that others abuse the obviously broken reward system to get attribute points every few days.

    which is ofc already announced to be nerfed soon™, but sure, let's pretend nothing is wrong, as usual.

    this system can never ever be fixed again, well done blindark!

    this will save me a shitload of money in future...
  14. Mindark's conception of unfairness and their willingness to fix "bugs" and exploits is really a big joke.
    Tell this to DannyO lol
    or explain me how i can play and deposit for 7 years and never get a hof until someone phones to Mindark so much he can not believe this can be possible and magically i get my FIRST & biggest hof ever in 2011 ? and never better... More than suspicious don't you think Mr Super Integrity CEO ?

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