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RE: Entropia Universe going Mainstream

Discussion in 'General Entropia Universe Discussion' started by MindStar9, Dec 17, 2013.

  1. AxeMurderer

    AxeMurderer Master Of Entropia

    While EU is not perfect with so many negtalks here I will ask you to show me 1 game that is better than EU. for mature player. I'm sure for kids there are other games to enjoy. Admin talks that in WOW you don't have to do same thing over and over again. But I played WOW and it was same thing over and over again.
  2. NotAdmin

    NotAdmin Administrator

    Games better than EU for mature players? I can name you some of the games I played this year which gave me more satisfaction than EU has, for a fraction of the price. EVE, The Last Of Us, GTA V, Star Citizen (not even released yet, and already a better game), Clash of Clans, Angry Birds, Call of Duty, Red Dead Redemption. Fricking Candybox is more entertaining than EU.

    My comparison with WOW was purely about gameplay. I haven't played WOW in years, but when I touched it (or, more recently, LOTRO), I at least had the ability to combine several skills to maximize my damage dealt to a MOB or other player. In EU, all you can do is... switch your weapon.

    In WOW, you get new skills that allow you to fight tougher mobs. In EU you gain new skills that do absolutely nothing other than dangle new carrots in your face, and in order to fight tougher MOBs, you need to upgrade your gear for hundreds if not thousands of dollars.
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  3. AxeMurderer

    AxeMurderer Master Of Entropia

    Thats my point. you can say the same for those games too. Angry Birds -> click drag release, click drag release, click drag release, ; If you search for EVE blogs you will see that the last blog from every EVE bloger is that he quits EVE :) every shooter or strategy game or RPG is kind of same thing again and again
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  4. Last of us and GTA. :'D

    But you cant just compare anything to the Entropia of 2004/2005. Impossiibruuuu !!!
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  5. Just read the thread on PCF... I think mobs not disappearing is a good thing, in RL dead things don't just vanish. So if there's 50 corns somewhere and you've got 6 of them, then there should only be 44 left unless more wander in. That aside, if MA wants EU to go mainstream then certain aspects of the game need to be changed.
    The skill system needs to be simplified and MA shouldn't insult peoples intelligence with cleverly disguised missions that in fact make you end up paying out far more in terms of running costs and repairs than you would if you played outside the mission system, which I did most of the time. Vehicle speeds needs to be more realistic, especially for aircraft/spacecraft and the space system needs to be revamped.
  6. Mainstream?? EU??? LOL
    Not now, not 5 years from now, not ever. In order to be mainstream regular average gamers would have to embrace EU. Go search around the net and find out what most regular gamers think of EU.
    It has one of the worst reputations out there.
    It has always been, and will always be a niche game. especially with Mindark running it.
    • Winner Winner x 3
  7. Jamira

    Jamira Samurai Girl

    THAT'S the reason I like it :-)
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  8. narfi

    narfi Lost

    You mean like the mindforce chips that slow down mobs?
    Or the Flamethrowers and Mindforce chips that do damage over time? (I read yesterday that the arsonistic TEN chip increases dps for everyone using a weapon under 130dps (new school math) which means everyone but the very elite)
    Or perhaps like the Vampiric cloak that heals you when you inflict damage?
    Or perhaps similar to the nanobots that increase or decrease different stats while you attack?
    Or perhaps you mean amps and tier enhacers which multiply damage?
    Or perhaps you mean something like mutant helmets or the new token armor that increase your dps or modifies other stats?
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  9. NotAdmin

    NotAdmin Administrator

    Heh. I didn't know any of those existed, narfi. Shows how long I haven't played.

    I do see a difference between an amp or tier enhancer and something like "stackable" spells though. The latter is strategy, as they typically do not cost anything extra to use (Mana perhaps?). The former just requires you to throw even more money at the game.
    • Agree Agree x 1
  10. narfi

    narfi Lost

    Well imo thats where the difference of an RCE comes in. Its pretty hard to compare apples and potatoes even though I enjoy and eat both.
    • Like Like x 1
  11. Tass

    Tass Administrator

    I agree with most of what has been said in this thread, from Acro to admin ;)

    But the thing is they don't change anything in gameplay - you still stand in front of a mob clicking it over and over again, tens of thousands after tens of thousands of mobs, year after year. The new items are merely deciding whether you can do it a little faster, a little more 'eco' or you can maybe do a little more harder mobs. They are not adding to the gameplay, rather the opposite is the case, they add additional micromanagement and worries about being as 'eco' as possible. Just as having iron challenge style missions for each and every mob plus daily missions is additional mircomanagement and unnecessary complications without adding to the game play. Ultimately the extent to which these missions are meanwhile available indicates the surrender of game design in face of EU's revenue model. And that's also one of the reasons why EU won't go mainstream, mainstream enjoys playing games, EU players enjoy (or feel forced) to configuring setups for minimizing loss in an endless chain of games of chance that give them enough thrill to keep doing all of that.
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  12. EU have a great potential, always had... I wont go to the "simplify the skills" path, because i think the opposite, EU is not for the casual players, or was not made with this in mind and is more oriented to be a more complex system, but at same time is not... I will post some toughts in the wishlist later
  13. dalewj

    dalewj StoryTeller/Nerd/Gamer

    I agree with you all. PE was a great game.. EU was the idea to take PE and make it mainstream. EU-2010 was the idea of WOWing down EU. Now we are stuck with a game with no identity, MA with no identity or plan to move forward (auto loot pill) and the PP getting screwed day by day by the inability for their dream to be approved and created by MA.

    It is sad and I think if their is a replacement (AW or ATD possibly) that MA will not fight back, but simply die. I see no effort in them now to make money, just gather a pay check.

    And yes we can blame some of this on what happened in 2008. Sure people stopped spending money, but if you run a company you make new plans, you change what your doing.. you fortify. You make partners with new people with new visions. And by far you make your current clients happier then they can ever be.. so they don't leave.

    But that didn't happen and well now we have EU-WOW.

    So I sit on the other planet (AW) playing and hoping that they will not lose the feel they have in their project when thy finally go big. One positive is they came from PE and saw what happened to it. I hope they learned.....
    • Agree Agree x 2
  14. NotAdmin

    NotAdmin Administrator

    I would love having a really extensive skill system in place. But the skills ought to give you some kind of actual benefit. I honestly have not noticed a difference after unlocking skills. Unlockable skills seem to be a carrot. "If I skill hard enough, I'll reach Marksmanship/Combat Sense/ Commando. I got to Combat Sense and blew PED to speed up the process to Commando for a while until I realized reaching that wouldn't make one fucking bit of difference.

    It's a carrot that is replaced with another carrot the second you get it. Got Commando? Then go get Kill Strike. Got that? Ooh, so close to 10/10. Get that? Arch Master is just a few clicks away, etc.

    Other games reward you somehow. New skills mean new abilities. In EU, nobody knows what skills do. They might make a major difference (Which nobody accurately managed to describe in the last 10 years), or they might not matter one bit.

    That happened. And MA shat and continues to shit on those partners the same way they shat and continues to shit on the customers. MA management is fucking clueless, corrupt, and frankly, unfit to manage anything. Heck, the only reason David Simmonds is CEO (on paper) is because Jan managed to persuade some investment bank that holds a 5% share in MA to pick his side after he got thrown out by the stockholders, and Jan simply placed a sock puppet on the throne. Make no mistake about who really calls the shots in MA though. It's the same guy who always has, and whose son runs Calypso.
    • Agree Agree x 1
  15. MindStar9

    MindStar9 Floating in Space

    I have to say that I heard good things about Klas as well, and that he was very much about doing the right things and making game play better, which got me excited, because maybe, JUST maybe there was finally someone on the inside who cared enough to work toward sorting all the crap out, but ...

    Just like you said Peter (about the muzzling), I was told point blank in an email from David Simmonds NOT to approach any MA or Calypso personnel for interviews without going through him first.

    Like others in the community who have become an "official" member of an EU development team, I learned first-hand just how difficult and challenging it was for PPs and their efforts to deliver their visions for what they would like to present to the community. Struggle after struggle, even though what they developed and tested on their own servers worked perfectly, it rarely came out as expected, and can you imagine the excitement of launching a planet after all your hard work, only to be disappointed that it didn't come out as intended, and that you were still waiting on systems to be implemented by MA that had been promised for so long.

    There's so much more I want to share here, but out of respect for the Cyrene Team and especially Ed and Kris, as well as others (officials) who have been enlightening, I'll just say, that those of you who are sincerely expressing your assessments of what is wrong with our universe, not out of spite because your loot sucks, but because you can see the big picture and how the path that MA has taken has done more damage than good, no matter HOW you look at it, you're definitely in the ball park.

    There was a time way back when I was a defender, and was called just about everything under the sun, but that was before I started learning things and seeing things from the inside out myself, and I can unequivocally say, that it made a HUGE difference for me. It wasn't about seeing the changes as a player over the years, but learning the truth behind the scenes that eventually led me to lose an enormous amount of respect for what MA is doing to this universe, and especially to the participants.

    There's no way that going mainstream will correct what is wrong ... it has to start at the top, and things have to be done not only more professionally, but more competently, because right now, it's a far cry from being in a state that will hold a large influx of new players for any length of time, and as some have said already, the ripple effect of that is that EU gains an even more damaging reputation than it has now.

    Over the years, I gave it my best shot to bring a more positive side of our universe to life, which is the community, rather than focusing so much on the dynamics and game-play, but certainly tried hard to support the developers through my writing. The problem there is, even that effort was censored to a degree, so I can see how those close to the developers have sort of a silent creed about what is reported.

    That's what I love about EP ... they go for the hardcore stories at times that really shed light on what's really going on, and ... even in their speculative pieces, they have solid and credible content that really makes us think about things a bit more. I totally respect the EP Team, even the ones who are a bit more pro EU and bring a different perspective. It's all about learning what works, and what really doesn't.

    I also totally respect those who can approach this universe with an open mind, whether I agree with them or not based on my own experiences over the last 8-1/2+ years, because critical thinking is what's required given the enormity and scope of what we're discussing here. Just to be clear, I am not saying that it's all bad, because I don't believe that, but know enough about what is bad, that there needs to be some drastic changes over time if MA and EU are going to survive and be anything but a cash cow for those who have seriously lost a vision, but ...

    That is just my view after being in the trenches.

    Thank you to all who have contributed their thoughts, I really appreciate it. :thumbsup:
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2013
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  16. well... MA almost was sold, so...
  17. I agree EU's reputation isn't great, I've read those reviews as well many times... But EU has the potential to go mainstream if MA bothered to make the changes that have been suggested.
  18. The convoluted skill system is half the problem. You can spend hundreds, thousands of PEDs on JUST extra IRD, or on JUST extra Rifle skill, or on JUST extra aim skill, etc, that increases that skill by not that much.
    I have no idea how much some of the uber players must have spent on reaching 100k + on almost every skill there is, which is what is required to really master EU, but it must be 1000's and 1000's of $, £, what have you - or as one very astute player once told me, 'enough money to buy a small car.'
  19. Wistrel

    Wistrel Kick Ass Elf

    So David is tha bad guy then? Hmmm.... he's a share holder? or at least fairly high up the earnings chart in the company I imagine... figures. So is MA a microcosm of North Korea now? ;)

    We need a new champion of the people in their ranks. Someone who will speak out.
  20. Hi,

    Thank you for the pointer! And I agree, a very good post by Acro, indeed!
    About "mainstream" ...

    PE/ EU never was, isn't now, and never will be "mainstream". In no way ever, without getting changed completely, changed more then it has been already.

    "RCE" and "mainstream" just doesn't fit together - the "mainstream" wants to play for free, for little money or, at least, for predictable sums. Yes, there's a lot of people out there that are ready to pay up to 50 $$$ a month, sometimes even more (google "F2P games"). But for this they expect ways more then MA is able to deliver.

    Tell your friendly neighborhood "mainstream gamer" that your "low middle class avatar" is in possession of gear worth some thousand $$$, and watch her face! (Better don't do this with ppl that you like!)

    Tell your friendly neighborhood "mainstream gamer" that you constantly do "runs" worth several 100 $$$ 10$$$ (edit: wrong number of zeros ...), often more then once a day, and that you usually have losses of 30 - 10%, but that you will, for sure, soon hit the huge jackpot! (Again, better don't do this with ppl that you like!)

    Beware, they'll declare you for mentally challenged, and if they don't call for those friendly men in white uniforms, with those cool calming injections, you can be happy ...

    About Steam ...

    What will happen if EU comes to Steam?
    1. Some ppl will vote up EU, many ppl will start to download it, and MA's ISP will provide a nice emergency bill for extreme use of bandwidth. It isn't that the client is just some 100 MB ...
    2. The poor hamsters at MA's sever farm will collapse due to overload, the game will be not available for a week at least.
    3. A high percentage of the new players will not ever deposit, why depositing for a game you cannot play? They'll be gone for good even before the servers are up again ...
    4. From those few that stay many will learn quickly that playing in EU needs a lot of patience and tenacity. They don't have, so they'll quickly leave for good.
    5. From those even fewer that stay many will learn quickly that playing in EU means dropping serious sums of real cash, ways more then for any other game comparable. They don't have, so they'll quickly leave for good.
    6. A few will stay, maybe start depositing, and will just drop later ...
    7. But a huge crowd will spam any available game forum with their venting, what a [...] EU would be, and how they have been fooled, and that nobody ever more should fall for this pathetic scam, and, and, and ...
    Result: Mission accomplished. Patient dead.
    I think there might be better ideas out there.

    Have fun! :)
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2013
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