Atlas Shrugged movie

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by sissi, Dec 10, 2014.

  1. sissi

    sissi sissi

    Sorry for off topic thread, but I´m always in search/lookout for Rand fans. Unfortunately there is no off-topic section on EP :( mods may delete or move thread to appropriate place as needed (tho it does fit in the max 20% off topic requirement)

    Found this question in a long post from JC and thought I´d start a thread to see how many other fans are here and their thoughts on the movie (I have not seen part III yet).

    I have read all her novels and probably most essays and in short I was really disappointed in the movie, part 1 being okayish (hardly) but part 2 was a serious letdown, hope part 3 managed to salvage some of the bad mouth taste after P2. Poor Ayn is probably cursing on the incompetence of the producers, directors and actors.

    Has anyone visited the Galt´s Gulch site?

  2. RAZER

    RAZER Custom title ... uh ...

    Well there is an off topic section and I move your thread there for you
  3. sissi

    sissi sissi

    opps, forgot to check subs... my bad.
    • Like Like x 1
  4. RAZER

    RAZER Custom title ... uh ...

    And to be honest I had never heard of that author or the movies.
  5. sissi

    sissi sissi

    replying to this would require a rather lengthy thread in itself. In short a philosopher who named her "teachings" objectivism, most famous books "Fountainhead" and "Atlas Shrugged" written in the 30s 40s, influenced by Nietzsche, very pro egotism and very against altruism.
  6. MindStar9

    MindStar9 Floating in Space

    I have the book "Anthem" by Ayn Rand, introduced to me by Obie a couple of years ago via Chapter 11 in a narrated recording which was pretty powerful, but I can't seem to find the recording now, at least not on my laptop - probably on the big computer.

    Chapter 11 may possibly be the most shared piece of work by Rand, don't really know, but it is certainly thought-provoking and if no one minds, I'll share the chapter with you.

    Chapter Eleven

    I am. I think. I will. My hands... My spirit... My sky... My forest... This earth of mine.... What must I say besides? These are the words. This is the answer. I stand here on the summit of the mountain. I lift my head and I spread my arms. This, my body and spirit, this is the end of the quest.

    I wished to know the meaning of things . I am the meaning. I wished to find a warrant for being. I need no warrant for being, and no word of sanction upon my being. I am the warrant and the sanction. It is my eyes which see, and the sight of my eyes grants beauty to the earth. It is my ears which hear, and the hearing of my ears gives its song to the world. It is my mind which thinks, and the judgment of my mind is the only searchlight that can find the truth. It is my will which chooses, and the choice of my will is the only edict I must respect.

    Many words have been granted me, and some are wise, and some are false, but only three are holy: "I will it!"

    Whatever road I take, the guiding star is within me; the guiding star and the loadstone which point the way. They point in but one direction. They point to me.

    I know not if this earth on which I stand is the core of the universe or if it is but a speck of dust lost in eternity. I know not and I care not. For I know what happiness is possible to me on earth. And my happiness needs no higher aim to vindicate it. My happiness is not the means to any end. It is the end. It is its own goal. It is its own purpose.

    Neither am I the means to any end others may wish to accomplish. I am not a tool for their use. I am not a servant of their needs. I am not a bandage for their wounds. I am not a sacrifice on their altars.

    I am a man. This miracle of me is mine to own and keep, and mine to guard, and mine to use, and mine to kneel before!

    I do not surrender my treasures, nor do I share them. The fortune of my spirit is not to be blown into coins of brass and flung to the winds as alms for the poor of the spirit. I guard my treasures: my thought, my will, my freedom. And the greatest of these is freedom.

    I owe nothing to my brothers, nor do I gather debts from them. I ask none to live for me, nor do I live for any others. I covet no man's soul, nor is my soul theirs to covet.

    I am neither foe nor friend to my brothers, but such as each of them shall deserve of me. And to earn my love, my brothers must do more than to have been born. I do not grant my love without reason, nor to any chance passer-by who may wish to claim it. I honor men with my love. But honor is a thing to be earned.

    I shall choose friends among men, but neither slaves nor masters. And I shall choose only such as please me, and them I shall love and respect, but neither command nor obey. And we shall join our hands when we wish, or walk alone when we so desire . For in the temple of his spirit, each man is alone. Let each man keep his temple untouched and undefiled. Then let him join hands with others if he wishes, but only beyond his holy threshold.

    For the word "We" must never be spoken, save by one's choice and as a second thought. This word must never be placed first within man's soul, else it becomes a monster, the root of all the evils on earth, the root of man's torture by men, and an unspeakable lie.

    The word "We " is as lime poured over men, which sets and hardens to stone, and crushes all beneath it, and that which is white and that which is black are lost equally in the grey of it. It is the word by which the depraved steal the virtue of the good, by which the weak steal the might of the strong, by which the fools steal the wisdom of the sages.

    What is my joy if all hands, even the unclean, can reach into it? What is my wisdom, if even the fools can dictate to me? What is my freedom, if all creatures, even the botched and impotent, are my masters? What is my life, if I am but to bow, to agree, and to obey?

    But I am done with this creed of corruption.

    I am done with the monster of "We," the word of serfdom, of plunder, of misery, falsehood and shame.

    Rand, Ayn (2012-05-12). Anthem (pp. 72-73). . Kindle Edition.
  7. I have Atlas Shrugged the book as well as the unabridged audiobooks both CD and MP3 forms, Saw all three parts in the theater, and have parts 1 & 2 on DVD. I have Fountainhead book, the movie on my computer, read Anthem, The Virtue of Selfishness, have her interviews on Mike Wallace and Donahue in my collection... Read/saw/listened to all multiple times.

    In short, yeah I'm a fan.

    The movies weren't too bad to me, but I'm easy to please.

    Here's something I've learned in my previous work in the audiobook industry:

    Audiobooks for a typical length book are 8-10 hours. Now imagine trying to squeeze all that book into a 2-2.5 hour movie. You have to cut out up to 4/5 of the book.

    Now since a lot of a book describes scenery that can be shown instantly in a movie, and action scenes can happen much faster than described, let's say we can cut the time required in half. That's still 5 hours that have to be schrunched into half the time.

    Also, when dealing with redoing someone else's art, in this case book and movie, you are at the mercy of the artists in question in terms of their interpretation of the previous artists' work multiplied by their skill at achieving their artistic vision. (Which is why I ALWAYS do UNabridged audiobooks, and avoid the abridged ones. Less chance of f*cking it up. Movies, I have no choice.)

    This just shows why a typical book-to-movie always seems to screw it up so bad.

    Atlas Shrugged is such a LONG, LONG book. To make it worse, the vast majority of it are long monologues (the epic one toward the end clocks over an hour in audio all by itself) or dialogues that are basically impossible to shorten for a movie unless you agree to give just the flavor, not the proper content.

    So even breaking it into 3 movies, you still have length problems. Besides that, the truth is watching every character monologue for 20 minutes is just not exciting to watch.

    Add in changes in character actors every movie and it's not a shock that the movies didn't live up to the expectations.

    The best part is that those who hate Ayn Rand use the movies lack of success as proof her ideas were wrong, when in fact, it's simply proof that the open market system works just quite well, just as she said. When you aren't able to produce a great product, you won't get great sales.
  8. sissi

    sissi sissi

    Will get back to you JC when I have seen part 3.
  9. NotAdmin

    NotAdmin Administrator

    I'm a Rand fan as well. Haven't seen any of the movies, though. I'm actually struggling to see how it could work as a movie to begin with.
  10. NotAdmin

    NotAdmin Administrator

    Egotism? I don't see it that way. To me, Rand doesn't say you should be selfish, but questions why you're often forced to charity, rather than doing so on your own terms. I fail to see why anyone thinks the government can do a better job at anything than I can. I'm pretty certain that I can get a better personally-tailored healthcare insurance for me and my family than someone else can, yet, when I would, the government won't refund the money they take to provide me with sub-standard healthcare (or education and a plethora of other services, for that matter).

    I'm not 100% agreeing with Rand either. I do think a social security system should be in place for those who through no fault of their own end up with a shitty hand of cards in life. I do, however, agree with her that moochers and looters should just be ignored.
  11. dalewj

    dalewj StoryTeller/Nerd/Gamer

    if you haven't read atlas shrugged I recommend it just for the way it makes it's point. Good book, the movies were mostly a waste of time. Not sure I read the books the way most people did as I got a different moral from them then most people talk to.

    But it is a long long book, and a very interesting read about humans.....
  12. sissi

    sissi sissi

    I believe Rand explained her view on egotism somewhere as "man is an end in himself", so to her it was not the text book definition that applied, but as you put it.

    And as you I don´t agree with Rand either on the premise that her philosophy builds on ideals that are quite unattainable by human beings, in other words it is idealistic as many other "isms" out there :) in this sense Nietzsche is a lot closer to me, especially if you use the proper definition of his concept of "ubermensch" which has wrongfully been translated super human (usually by the people who call him nazi) while he saw it as a mans goal to evolve "over=uber" himself, call it buddhistic if you will.

    Well Fountainhead with Gary Cooper was actually pretty decent, so I don´t see why AS couldn´t have been done better.
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